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Shanky Technologies Poker Bot Support Forum  |  General Category  |  PPL Support (Moderator: sngbot)  |  Topic: Famous LastRaiserPosition 0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.
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Author Topic: Famous LastRaiserPosition  (Read 2997 times)
__Trueno__
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« on: April 07, 2014, 06:03:38 AM »

It is clear that both Hero's and Villain's CBets require specific handling in the code, as we would normally use different ranges for betting, calling or reraising CBets than we would use for non continuation bets. It is therefore important to know who was preflop last raiser and also who is flop and turn last raisers and, more important, if they are the same player.

I have read several posts dealing with this issue, but I have not found a final solution for this. I do not think it is possible with current PPL variables. I would like to propose two new boolean variables:

- FlopCBet: true when the last flop raiser is also last preflop raiser. Only available postflop.
- TurnCBet: true when the last turn raiser is also last preflop raiser. Only available at turn and river.

Egor, it would be great if we could have something like this. Thanks.
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The success takes to know where you are, to know where you want to go, and to know what you have to do to get there. Often, the most difficult one is the first.
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« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2014, 07:07:25 AM »

Please describe a situation, a specific example, in which they would be useful. I think you might be mixing the action raise with bet in places. For an opponent to raise the flop, for example, another player must have first bet on the flop (or raised his initial flop bet).

Also, if you are heads up post-flop it doesn't matter, right? And if you just want to know that your lone opponent raised the flop (or bet) that can easily be done with a user-defined variable.

If you are not heads up post-flop and there are raises, I can't see you being there with a hand you wouldn't simply push with.

 thanks
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Please do not PM me about license issues or help stuff - email me or use the Help board. Thanks! -Egor
__Trueno__
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« Reply #2 on: April 08, 2014, 04:54:33 AM »

Please describe a situation, a specific example, in which they would be useful. I think you might be mixing the action raise with bet in places. For an opponent to raise the flop, for example, another player must have first bet on the flop (or raised his initial flop bet).

Also, if you are heads up post-flop it doesn't matter, right? And if you just want to know that your lone opponent raised the flop (or bet) that can easily be done with a user-defined variable.

If you are not heads up post-flop and there are raises, I can't see you being there with a hand you wouldn't simply push with.

 thanks

Thanks Egor.

No. What I am talking about has nothing to do with the difference between a bet and a raise, which I fully understand.

I rarely play HU, except in final tables. Also, when playing 6-max or full-ring I try to play other than just push or fold. This is why I am after knowing if I am facing a CBet or a Bet.

I am talking about the impossibility to determine the position of the last raiser in second orbit preflop or last raiser postflop, and compare them.

Some related posts:
http://bonusbots.com/support/index.php/topic,7158.msg72200.html#msg72200
http://bonusbots.com/support/index.php/topic,1400.msg13455.html#msg13455
http://bonusbots.com/support/index.php/topic,2615.msg25985.html#msg25985
http://bonusbots.com/support/index.php/topic,142.msg539.html#msg539
http://bonusbots.com/support/index.php/topic,2271.msg21891.html#msg21891

Imagine this:
- For each street, the bot stores the name of last raiser player in an internal string variable.
- In Flop and Turn the bot compares the value of the preflop string variable with the flop or turn string variable after any raise, and sets the external boolean variables FlopCBet or TurnCBet if there is a match.
Easy.

Thank you.
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The success takes to know where you are, to know where you want to go, and to know what you have to do to get there. Often, the most difficult one is the first.
Egor
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« Reply #3 on: April 08, 2014, 05:09:35 AM »

I'm sorry you are losing me.

Please describe a poker situation in detail, or maybe provide a bot-log, explaining where/how such a new variable would be used.

 thanks
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Please do not PM me about license issues or help stuff - email me or use the Help board. Thanks! -Egor
__Trueno__
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« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2014, 10:51:58 PM »

OK. A 6-max table.

Preflop
SB 1c
BB 2c
UTG Call
MP Raise 6c
CO Fold
BU (Hero) Call
SB Call
BB Call
UTG Call

Flop
SB Bets 12c
BB Call
UTG Call
MP Call
BU (Hero) What to do?

Analysis
Bets = 1
Raises = 0
Calls = 3
Folds = 0

Who was the raiser?

a) If raiser was SB, BB or UTG (donk bet) I would normally call only with a tighter range of hands (~20%) as this may indicate that the raiser hit the flop and made a good hand.
b) If raiser was MP (also was preflop last raiser) I would normally call (or raise) with a much wider range of hands (~30%), since everybody knows that preflop last raiser will CBet in Flop (~65% of times) even if the flop was really bad for him.

That is why I want to know if I am facing a Bet, or a CBet.

If it was a Bet the proposed variable FlopCBet would be false. If it was a CBet the variable would be true, and I could use it to discriminate my calling ranges.

Thanks.
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The success takes to know where you are, to know where you want to go, and to know what you have to do to get there. Often, the most difficult one is the first.
Egor
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Extreme Botter
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Karma: 373
Posts: 34618



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« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2014, 11:04:40 PM »

You can use lastraiserposition = preflop (on the first orbit) to set a user-defined variable that identifies the position of the raiser. That can then be referred to later. In your example, because there were three callers you know it wasn't the preflop raiser who bet the flop.

Honestly, though, I can't see where this is useful in your example. If there's four opponents on the flop who are all putting money in, I better have darn near the nuts, or a draw to it, if I am continuing. Who the initial raiser was doesn't matter. There's too many opponents in there. Somebody has top pair beat.
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Please do not PM me about license issues or help stuff - email me or use the Help board. Thanks! -Egor
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Shanky Technologies Poker Bot Support Forum  |  General Category  |  PPL Support (Moderator: sngbot)  |  Topic: Famous LastRaiserPosition
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